Comments on: Because I couldn’t speak up in class http://serenae.com/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/ Freelance Creativity Sun, 06 May 2012 23:43:19 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3 By: Serena http://serenae.com/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/comment-page-1/#comment-463 Serena Tue, 24 Feb 2009 05:27:42 +0000 http://serena.umwblogs.org/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/#comment-463 @Gardner - It was a little mortifying reading it again after all this time. But that's the wonderful thing about writing, isn't it? @Gardner – It was a little mortifying reading it again after all this time. But that’s the wonderful thing about writing, isn’t it?

]]> By: Gardner http://serenae.com/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/comment-page-1/#comment-458 Gardner Mon, 23 Feb 2009 13:16:15 +0000 http://serena.umwblogs.org/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/#comment-458 Brings back memories. Good memories. Brings back memories. Good memories.

]]> By: Dancing Bread Rolls » Shades of Gray (and red) (and green) http://serenae.com/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/comment-page-1/#comment-162 Dancing Bread Rolls » Shades of Gray (and red) (and green) Fri, 27 Apr 2007 20:19:33 +0000 http://serena.umwblogs.org/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/#comment-162 [...] I’d like to explore the greater symbolic meanings of these colors a little further. I’m going to make a sweeping philosophical statement and assert that the interplay of courage and fear is essential to love. The euphoria commonly associated with romance is produced entirely by this balance. So is this what love is all about? Courage and fear? Perhaps. (And don’t forget the orange, the desire.) However, if these were the only necessary elements for love, wouldn’t things have worked out for Scottie and Judy? Or, perhaps, they weren’t destined to be together at all. This brings up the question of soul mates all over again. Does the fact that things don’t ultimately end well mean that it was never meant to be? Are Scottie and Judy, just like Eben and Jennie, doomed from the outset? Is their love less true because it doesn’t culminate in their lasting happiness? This question leads nicely into… PART TWO:There has been quite a lot of discussion over what exactly distinguishes Midge from Madeleine, and what makes Madeleine ‘right’ for Scottie. However, this approach is inherently flawed, because it assumes that Madeleine is right for Scottie. In my post on the 13th, I said that Eben and Jennie are not soul mates…Their love is not true. On Eben’s part, it’s the idea of it and on Jennie’s side…who knows? They’re both completely in love with the idea of love and the security and comfort of it. [...] [...] I’d like to explore the greater symbolic meanings of these colors a little further. I’m going to make a sweeping philosophical statement and assert that the interplay of courage and fear is essential to love. The euphoria commonly associated with romance is produced entirely by this balance. So is this what love is all about? Courage and fear? Perhaps. (And don’t forget the orange, the desire.) However, if these were the only necessary elements for love, wouldn’t things have worked out for Scottie and Judy? Or, perhaps, they weren’t destined to be together at all. This brings up the question of soul mates all over again. Does the fact that things don’t ultimately end well mean that it was never meant to be? Are Scottie and Judy, just like Eben and Jennie, doomed from the outset? Is their love less true because it doesn’t culminate in their lasting happiness? This question leads nicely into… PART TWO:There has been quite a lot of discussion over what exactly distinguishes Midge from Madeleine, and what makes Madeleine ‘right’ for Scottie. However, this approach is inherently flawed, because it assumes that Madeleine is right for Scottie. In my post on the 13th, I said that Eben and Jennie are not soul mates…Their love is not true. On Eben’s part, it’s the idea of it and on Jennie’s side…who knows? They’re both completely in love with the idea of love and the security and comfort of it. [...]

]]> By: Blog Title http://serenae.com/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/comment-page-1/#comment-161 Blog Title Fri, 27 Apr 2007 19:15:41 +0000 http://serena.umwblogs.org/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/#comment-161 [...] This brings me to Serena’s blog. I’ve got to applaud her brutally honest perception of Eben and Jennie. She raises valid points, like why Jennie and Eben assume they’re in love? What do they have in common? I just accepted that they were in love and never questioned it. Eben brings up our ignorance and I think you need it for this life. I never questioned their love for the same reason men dedicate themselves to god. You’ve got to have faith. You can’t believe in the concept of a soul-mate without having faith or believing in fate. My roommate said it quite frankly, what are the odds that I’d find my soul mate in the infinite number of people who lived, are living and will live? The answer is you’ve got to have faith. It’s not a great answer, but it’s the best we have to offer. I’ve got a passage that Serena might like to disembowel the way she did to that class lecture.  [...] [...] This brings me to Serena’s blog. I’ve got to applaud her brutally honest perception of Eben and Jennie. She raises valid points, like why Jennie and Eben assume they’re in love? What do they have in common? I just accepted that they were in love and never questioned it. Eben brings up our ignorance and I think you need it for this life. I never questioned their love for the same reason men dedicate themselves to god. You’ve got to have faith. You can’t believe in the concept of a soul-mate without having faith or believing in fate. My roommate said it quite frankly, what are the odds that I’d find my soul mate in the infinite number of people who lived, are living and will live? The answer is you’ve got to have faith. It’s not a great answer, but it’s the best we have to offer. I’ve got a passage that Serena might like to disembowel the way she did to that class lecture.  [...]

]]> By: . » Blog Archive » nescio sed fieri sentio http://serenae.com/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/comment-page-1/#comment-160 . » Blog Archive » nescio sed fieri sentio Tue, 17 Apr 2007 22:15:18 +0000 http://serena.umwblogs.org/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/#comment-160 [...] Serena, et al, this is what I think of Eben and Jennie being in love. [...] [...] Serena, et al, this is what I think of Eben and Jennie being in love. [...]

]]> By: Carmen http://serenae.com/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/comment-page-1/#comment-159 Carmen Sun, 15 Apr 2007 21:12:18 +0000 http://serena.umwblogs.org/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/#comment-159 Yeah Serena, what is the beans thing? You never gave me an answer and I would really like to know. Yeah Serena, what is the beans thing? You never gave me an answer and I would really like to know.

]]> By: Robyn’s Blog » Blog Archive » Loving for the “wrong” reasons is still love http://serenae.com/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/comment-page-1/#comment-158 Robyn’s Blog » Blog Archive » Loving for the “wrong” reasons is still love Sat, 14 Apr 2007 18:23:57 +0000 http://serena.umwblogs.org/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/#comment-158 [...] I agree with a lot of what Serenais saying in her post about how it is possible that Jennie and Eben are in love with the idea of love, and all the other various insignificant reasons to love someone that Serena lists in her blog.  However, I don’t think you need a good reason to love someone.  Maybe you are lonely, or afraid, or young, or naive, or stupid–but just because you don’t have a legitimate reason to be in love doesn’t discount being in love.  For whatever reason, Jennie and Eben love each other.  [...] [...] I agree with a lot of what Serenais saying in her post about how it is possible that Jennie and Eben are in love with the idea of love, and all the other various insignificant reasons to love someone that Serena lists in her blog.  However, I don’t think you need a good reason to love someone.  Maybe you are lonely, or afraid, or young, or naive, or stupid–but just because you don’t have a legitimate reason to be in love doesn’t discount being in love.  For whatever reason, Jennie and Eben love each other.  [...]

]]> By: breijo’s rear window ethics http://serenae.com/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/comment-page-1/#comment-157 breijo’s rear window ethics Sat, 14 Apr 2007 14:30:25 +0000 http://serena.umwblogs.org/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/#comment-157 [...] Where to begin… First of all, yesterday’s class discussion on art and soulmates was probably my favorite we’ve had yet. As I mentioned in my previous post, I’m really interested in the correllation of eternal art and eternal love…are they one in the same? Who knows, I guess it’s up to interpretation. I also think that Serena’s view of what defines an artist is very interesting. To say that an artist cannot be an artist because they rely too heavily on inspiration but also use it as an excuse to not paint is very interesting. As I am not an artist, I’m not sure if I agree or disagree-I think it’s an interesting point that deserves some thought, though, because this means that an artist doesn’t simply paint, draw, or construct; this means that an artist must meet emotional and other criteria to fit the description. Very interesting… As for the film itself, I really want to see the second half because the narrative is so damned funny. (What was that one line…”All of a sudden I was aware of a consciousness I had not yet experienced” or something along those lines&#823 Who talks like that? Who believes a narrative that sounds like that??? It’s ridiculous but incredibly laughable. I’d also like to note Joey’s detection of noir themes in the film…I agree to the extent that Eben’s narrative (when it happens) is detective-like, but I feel that this falls more under the classification of the old episodes of The Twilight Zone, a favorite of mine. The unnamed narrator with the straight, just-the-facts voice overs and the deliberate tone even sounds like Rod Serling! It’s like watching the old episodes but with much more ridiculous/less realistic acting and the added Eben voice overs. I feel it has some undertones of noir, but then again, by that token, wouldn’t The Twilight Zone? Genre is a tricky subject. Anything with time travel can’t be considered to be science fiction right away, can it? I admit, this seems like it has some traces of that, but I wouldn’t classify it as scifi…I also wouldn’t consider it to be a love story, though. I don’t feel that it can be a love story if the protagonists are not in love, and I don’t feel that they are here. I feel it is more of an obsession for both; how could Jenny know that she loves him so quickly? I think it’s a fancy that they pursue, and that is what drives the story. This can’t truly be a tragedy-think about it. She dies before him in history, she dies before him in real-time. And for what? It isn’t heart-wrenching for the audience (not really)-but I’m excited to see how they execute the end of the novel in the film nonetheless. I guess what I’m wondering is if there are tell-tale signs of a genre that should be setting off flashing lights in our mind. (Time travel=scifi? Love story=two people overcoming obstacles, soulmates or not? Tragedy=death of a protagonist to be with the other?) I feel that jennie is a mishmash of genres and it’s nearly impossible to pin it down as one, but I also feel that it doesn’t meet all the necessary criteria for even one of those.If there are genre signals, there are far too many in Jennie to decide on one, if any. [...] [...] Where to begin… First of all, yesterday’s class discussion on art and soulmates was probably my favorite we’ve had yet. As I mentioned in my previous post, I’m really interested in the correllation of eternal art and eternal love…are they one in the same? Who knows, I guess it’s up to interpretation. I also think that Serena’s view of what defines an artist is very interesting. To say that an artist cannot be an artist because they rely too heavily on inspiration but also use it as an excuse to not paint is very interesting. As I am not an artist, I’m not sure if I agree or disagree-I think it’s an interesting point that deserves some thought, though, because this means that an artist doesn’t simply paint, draw, or construct; this means that an artist must meet emotional and other criteria to fit the description. Very interesting… As for the film itself, I really want to see the second half because the narrative is so damned funny. (What was that one line…”All of a sudden I was aware of a consciousness I had not yet experienced” or something along those lines&#823 Who talks like that? Who believes a narrative that sounds like that??? It’s ridiculous but incredibly laughable. I’d also like to note Joey’s detection of noir themes in the film…I agree to the extent that Eben’s narrative (when it happens) is detective-like, but I feel that this falls more under the classification of the old episodes of The Twilight Zone, a favorite of mine. The unnamed narrator with the straight, just-the-facts voice overs and the deliberate tone even sounds like Rod Serling! It’s like watching the old episodes but with much more ridiculous/less realistic acting and the added Eben voice overs. I feel it has some undertones of noir, but then again, by that token, wouldn’t The Twilight Zone? Genre is a tricky subject. Anything with time travel can’t be considered to be science fiction right away, can it? I admit, this seems like it has some traces of that, but I wouldn’t classify it as scifi…I also wouldn’t consider it to be a love story, though. I don’t feel that it can be a love story if the protagonists are not in love, and I don’t feel that they are here. I feel it is more of an obsession for both; how could Jenny know that she loves him so quickly? I think it’s a fancy that they pursue, and that is what drives the story. This can’t truly be a tragedy-think about it. She dies before him in history, she dies before him in real-time. And for what? It isn’t heart-wrenching for the audience (not really)-but I’m excited to see how they execute the end of the novel in the film nonetheless. I guess what I’m wondering is if there are tell-tale signs of a genre that should be setting off flashing lights in our mind. (Time travel=scifi? Love story=two people overcoming obstacles, soulmates or not? Tragedy=death of a protagonist to be with the other?) I feel that jennie is a mishmash of genres and it’s nearly impossible to pin it down as one, but I also feel that it doesn’t meet all the necessary criteria for even one of those.If there are genre signals, there are far too many in Jennie to decide on one, if any. [...]

]]> By: Dr. C. http://serenae.com/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/comment-page-1/#comment-156 Dr. C. Sat, 14 Apr 2007 14:24:50 +0000 http://serena.umwblogs.org/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/#comment-156 Wow. Thank you for this post, Serena. It's hard to be thoughtful, rigorously analytical, and passionate all at once, but you've certainly managed it here. I have a lot to think about and a lot to respond to, but I needed to say right away that I am grateful you've shared your response with us. Electric. What is the "beans" idea? My curiosity is picqued. This class is going to be more prepared for "Vertigo" than any I can remember. "Vertigo," of course, turns all these issues up to 11.... Wow. Thank you for this post, Serena. It’s hard to be thoughtful, rigorously analytical, and passionate all at once, but you’ve certainly managed it here.

I have a lot to think about and a lot to respond to, but I needed to say right away that I am grateful you’ve shared your response with us. Electric.

What is the “beans” idea? My curiosity is picqued.

This class is going to be more prepared for “Vertigo” than any I can remember. “Vertigo,” of course, turns all these issues up to 11….

]]> By: stephanie http://serenae.com/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/comment-page-1/#comment-155 stephanie Sat, 14 Apr 2007 14:04:28 +0000 http://serena.umwblogs.org/2007/04/13/because-i-couldnt-speak-up-in-class/#comment-155 This post is so passionate and wonderful-they are weak. We all are. And I can't say what constitutes a real artist and what doesn't, but I do believe that this love of commitment and safety is a large driving force of most loves, superficial or not. Also, I think you really hit on something with your "beans" idea...it got me thinking of the novel, and this course, in a whole new light. In fact, I'm not sure what I would do without it at this point in the semester. Completely enlightening. I totally owe you one. This post is so passionate and wonderful-they are weak. We all are. And I can’t say what constitutes a real artist and what doesn’t, but I do believe that this love of commitment and safety is a large driving force of most loves, superficial or not.

Also,
I think you really hit on something with your “beans” idea…it got me thinking of the novel, and this course, in a whole new light. In fact, I’m not sure what I would do without it at this point in the semester. Completely enlightening. I totally owe you one.

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